>I suppose it’s possible to get a pretty good env with vim (you’re losing a lot without a mouse), but damn it’s a lot of work to get there...
>unless you like manipulating your tools 10x slower than ide users
Imo using mouse alone makes you at least twice as slow as using keyboard shortcuts. Not only do you need to physically move your hand and find your mouse, then you need to locate your pointer (which might not even be on the same screen) then you need to swing it in the approximately right region of screen and search for the button to click. Only to return your hand back to familiar keyboard. All the while you probably could have just pressed 2-3 buttons and be done with it.
>Also vim seems less discoverable to me. If something’s not a keybind you already set up, you need to look up plug-in docs, or tab through all the hundreds of possible commands.
The handy `:help <what-you-want-to-know-about>` has so far served me well, when searching how to do stuff in vim.
Otherwise it is obviously up to your taste. I truly believe that you are wrong, just as much as you believe that I am. From my point of view you probably didn't give vim a proper chance (most likely you fell into the few big potholes that many beginners find themselves, which I'll admit is fault of the default vim configuration)
As for
>ctags for every language? Official language plugins?
Excuberant-ctags have so far worked with me on all but one language (Robot Framework), but people have long told me that exuberant-ctags is bad and I should use something else that is more advanced, I just haven't bothered since it handles C++ and Python well and that's all I currently care about. For language plugins, I guess only thing I have is specific syntax file for Robot Framework, but that's again only because it's still uncommon tool, so support for it is lacking.
I'll give it a try. At least there seems to be parser for Robot Framework, which could be handy. Although I've already written my own, but it only sort of works and it's pretty hack-y.
When I was talking about discoverability I meant assuming you don’t know all the exact command names and what they do. I thought you neeeded to know the exact command name to use :help, so I’m not seeing how that’s an answer here.
Also, yes the mouse can be slow for some purposes, but if you’re not in a typing frenzy it’s probably easier to be in mouse mode which is something like reading mode. Scrolling is much easier for me outside of vim than inside of vim. Also I considered that this is maybe a better match to my workflow, which is often more readingand thinking than actual keyboard input. So it’s ok for keyboard input to be less prioritized. For this workflow having inline documentation, intellisense and compiler errors as you type is fundamental.
Also I doubt I ran into the beginner traps. I used it pretty seriously and exclusively for a year or two and am still proficient at navigating. I even got into using macros like other commenters mentioned, and learned all the different edit mode shortcuts (cxsSDCiaAOo). Seriously editing in vim is really really fast. Although maybe there are traps for people that I don’t already know about, and you could fill me in on those.
>unless you like manipulating your tools 10x slower than ide users
Imo using mouse alone makes you at least twice as slow as using keyboard shortcuts. Not only do you need to physically move your hand and find your mouse, then you need to locate your pointer (which might not even be on the same screen) then you need to swing it in the approximately right region of screen and search for the button to click. Only to return your hand back to familiar keyboard. All the while you probably could have just pressed 2-3 buttons and be done with it.
>Also vim seems less discoverable to me. If something’s not a keybind you already set up, you need to look up plug-in docs, or tab through all the hundreds of possible commands.
The handy `:help <what-you-want-to-know-about>` has so far served me well, when searching how to do stuff in vim.
Otherwise it is obviously up to your taste. I truly believe that you are wrong, just as much as you believe that I am. From my point of view you probably didn't give vim a proper chance (most likely you fell into the few big potholes that many beginners find themselves, which I'll admit is fault of the default vim configuration)
As for >ctags for every language? Official language plugins?
Excuberant-ctags have so far worked with me on all but one language (Robot Framework), but people have long told me that exuberant-ctags is bad and I should use something else that is more advanced, I just haven't bothered since it handles C++ and Python well and that's all I currently care about. For language plugins, I guess only thing I have is specific syntax file for Robot Framework, but that's again only because it's still uncommon tool, so support for it is lacking.